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Maloula ASSYRIANS?

Nemrud

New member
SonOfAssyria said:
Exactly, according to them. They considered him a crown of glory for all the Arameans. As far as I know he never even called himself Aramean. Heck, I'm fairly certain that most of these quotes from all these church leaders about us being Aramean are taken out of context.
I dont know and I dont care, the important is that he called us Assyrians, and we had then also an assyrian identity in our head.
 

Nemrud

New member
Western Neo-Aramaic
Aromay, Loghtha Aramoytha, Malouli Syriac, Lishona Aromay, Siryon, Loghtha Siryanoytha[1]
????? - ????? Aromay
?????? ?r?m?

They call their language syriac and aramaic, thats why they call themselves suroy and Aromay.
 

Nemrud

New member
Suroy doesnt mean aramean, it means syriac, its an identity based on their language according to my research. Actually their language are similiar to ours because they say for example Hello / Peace ?loma=shlomo, and Water M?ya=maye. Actually suroy could mean aramean because they call their language Lishona Aromay=Loghtha Siryanoytha, so they clearly say suroy is synonym to aramean, but why? Sure our ancients called us assyrians and arameans but if suroy is synonym to aramean then they either are assyrians or arameans and so are we, because suroy=suroyo/suraya.

As l have been seen noone were able to explain this mystery, l hope now you can.
 

Nemrud

New member
now when l think about it maybe for them suroy means aramean because syria refered to aram a long time ago and for us suroyo means assyrian, maybe just maybe. Maybe they adopted the name suroy... i dont know.
 

Nemrud

New member
The terms Syrian or Syriac relate not to their ethnicity but to their historical, religious, and liturgical connection to Syriac Christianity. This is the st thomas christians who probably call their language similiar to us, now maybe the maloula think the same, suroy is not their etnicity.
 

Nemrud

New member
Western Neo-Aramaic
Aromay, Loghtha Aramoytha, Malouli Syriac, Lishona Aromay, Siryon, Loghtha Siryanoytha[1]
????? - ????? Aromay
?????? ?r?m?

then why do they call  themselves suroy, explain that please....
 

mrzurnaci

New member
Nemrud said:
Western Neo-Aramaic
Aromay, Loghtha Aramoytha, Malouli Syriac, Lishona Aromay, Siryon, Loghtha Siryanoytha[1]
????? - ????? Aromay
?????? ?r?m?

then why do they call  themselves suroy, explain that please....
Suroy is Syrian, What sense of Syrian? I don't know, it could mean that they're native people of Syria which Arameans are.
 

Nemrud

New member
mrzurnaci said:
Suroy is Syrian, What sense of Syrian? I don't know, it could mean that they're native people of Syria which Arameans are.
How do you know its not syriac, in Wikipedia its syriac, maronites speak syriac in Church...  Suroy must be syriac, l cant believe u dont take this serious.... And yes, when l look at their words l understand them a bit so they must be syriac. They are not refering to their country or else they wouldnt say Loghtha Siryanoytha, lushono suryoyo
 

mrzurnaci

New member
Nemrud said:
How do you know its not syriac, in Wikipedia its syriac, maronites speak syriac in Church...  Suroy must be syriac, l cant believe u dont take this serious.... And yes, when l look at their words l understand them a bit so they must be syriac. They are not refering to their country or else they wouldnt say Loghtha Siryanoytha, lushono suryoyo
Maronaya/Moronoyo aren't Assyrian/Syriac though. Suroy can't be Syriac though, Ma'loula people use Western Aramaic which is different from Syriac. Western Aramaic and Syriac have been separated for over 1000 years.
 

Nemrud

New member
mrzurnaci said:
Maronaya/Moronoyo aren't Assyrian/Syriac though. Suroy can't be Syriac though, Ma'loula people use Western Aramaic which is different from Syriac. Western Aramaic and Syriac have been separated for over 1000 years.
But why do l then understand their words????
 

mrzurnaci

New member
Nemrud said:
But why do l then understand their words????
Because their words are in all Aramaic dialects.
Words are not what separates the dialects, grammar and pronounciation is.

Here's an example alongside Turoyo, Classical Syriac, and Hebrew:

Western Neo-Aramaic: Ōboḥ ti bi
 

Nemrud

New member
Didnt the greeks call all syrias people syrians? and there were many people living in syria, hettites, arameans, assyrians , hurrians etc, they even called hettites white-syrians, the arameans must have adopted the name syrian to suroy, and we kept it always, calling us ashurayu, shurayu, suraya, suroyo, suryoyo, because thats proven by simo parpola.

Btw, do anyone know why the greeks called assyrians western territories syria? i know syria comes from assyria but why did they call it syria?
 

mrzurnaci

New member
Nemrud said:
Didnt the greeks call all syrias people syrians? and there were many people living in syria, hettites, arameans, assyrians , hurrians etc, they even called hettites white-syrians, the arameans must have adopted the name syrian to suroy, and we kept it always, calling us ashurayu, shurayu, suraya, suroyo, suryoyo, because thats proven by simo parpola.

Btw, do anyone know why the greeks called assyrians western territories syria? i know syria comes from assyria but why did they call it syria?
the Greeks called it Syria because of two reasons:
1. historical - when many Greeks visited the Middle East, it was when the Assyrian empire was in control as was the region of Syria.
2. general discrimination/racism - Greeks didn't take the time or care to bother who the people were, so they just called it Syria even though Assyrians mostly lived on the Eastern part of the Furat river, not the Western part.
 

Nemrud

New member
mrzurnaci said:
the Greeks called it Syria because of two reasons:
1. historical - when many Greeks visited the Middle East, it was when the Assyrian empire was in control as was the region of Syria.
2. general discrimination/racism - Greeks didn't take the time or care to bother who the people were, so they just called it Syria even though Assyrians mostly lived on the Eastern part of the Furat river, not the Western part.
yes, the greeks and romans saw all other people as barbarians,  i dont think the ancient assyrians did.
 

Nemrud

New member
The history of Syriac can be divided into three distinct periods:

Old Aramaic, the language of the Syro-Hittite states of the Levant in the Early Iron Age, Old Aramaic was adopted as a lingua franca (besides Akkadian) in the Neo-Assyrian Empire

Middle Syriac/Middle Syriac Aramaic (?????? K????n?y?, "Literary Syriac"), which is divided into:

Eastern Middle Syriac/Eastern Middle Syriac Aramaic (the literary and ecclesiastical language of the ethnic Syriac Christians of the Assyrian Church of the East, Chaldean Catholic Church, Ancient Church of the East and Assyrian Pentecostal Church)

Western Middle Syriac/Western Middle Syriac Aramaic (the literary and ecclesiastical language of the largely Syriac members of the Syriac Orthodox Church, Syriac Catholic Church and Syriac Maronite Church).

"Modern Syriac"/"Modern Syriac Aramaic" is a term occasionally used to refer to the modern Eastern Aramaic languages.[16] Even if they cannot be positively identified as the direct descendants of attested Middle Syriac, they must have developed from closely related dialects belonging to the same branch of Aramaic, and the varieties spoken in Christian communities have long co-existed with and been influenced by Middle Syriac as a liturgical and literary language. In this terminology, Modern Syriac is divided into:

Modern Western Syriac Aramaic (Turoyo and Mlahs?). Note however that these are sometimes excluded from the category of "Modern Syriac".[16]

Modern Eastern Syriac Aramaic (Northeastern Neo-Aramaic, including Assyrian Neo-Aramaic and Chaldean Neo-Aramaic but the term usually is not used in reference to Neo-Mandaic, another variety of Eastern Aramaic spoken by the Mandaeans).

The name "Syriac", when used with no qualification, generally refers to one specific dialect of Middle Aramaic but not to Old Aramaic or to the various present-day Eastern and Central Neo-Aramaic languages descended from it or from close relatives. The modern varieties are, therefore, not discussed in this article.

Now to my question, which of these syriac language are spoken by the indian church? or other unkown churches that isnt assyrian....

What makes the syriac dialect of aramaic more assyrian than the other aramaic languages that exists, for example mandaic? all that are eastern or central aramaic etc....

Why cant maronites be assyrians? is it because they dont identify themselves as it? they do speak western syriac after all....

What is it that makes us assyrians? it cant be the language because many different ethnic groups speak it. is it because we always identify ourselves as assyrians, our forefathers?

 

mrzurnaci

New member
Nemrud said:
The history of Syriac can be divided into three distinct periods:

Old Aramaic, the language of the Syro-Hittite states of the Levant in the Early Iron Age, Old Aramaic was adopted as a lingua franca (besides Akkadian) in the Neo-Assyrian Empire

Middle Syriac/Middle Syriac Aramaic (?????? K????n?y?, "Literary Syriac"), which is divided into:

Eastern Middle Syriac/Eastern Middle Syriac Aramaic (the literary and ecclesiastical language of the ethnic Syriac Christians of the Assyrian Church of the East, Chaldean Catholic Church, Ancient Church of the East and Assyrian Pentecostal Church)

Western Middle Syriac/Western Middle Syriac Aramaic (the literary and ecclesiastical language of the largely Syriac members of the Syriac Orthodox Church, Syriac Catholic Church and Syriac Maronite Church).

"Modern Syriac"/"Modern Syriac Aramaic" is a term occasionally used to refer to the modern Eastern Aramaic languages.[16] Even if they cannot be positively identified as the direct descendants of attested Middle Syriac, they must have developed from closely related dialects belonging to the same branch of Aramaic, and the varieties spoken in Christian communities have long co-existed with and been influenced by Middle Syriac as a liturgical and literary language. In this terminology, Modern Syriac is divided into:

Modern Western Syriac Aramaic (Turoyo and Mlahs?). Note however that these are sometimes excluded from the category of "Modern Syriac".[16]

Modern Eastern Syriac Aramaic (Northeastern Neo-Aramaic, including Assyrian Neo-Aramaic and Chaldean Neo-Aramaic but the term usually is not used in reference to Neo-Mandaic, another variety of Eastern Aramaic spoken by the Mandaeans).

The name "Syriac", when used with no qualification, generally refers to one specific dialect of Middle Aramaic but not to Old Aramaic or to the various present-day Eastern and Central Neo-Aramaic languages descended from it or from close relatives. The modern varieties are, therefore, not discussed in this article.

Now to my question, which of these syriac language are spoken by the indian church? or other unkown churches that isnt assyrian....

What makes the syriac dialect of aramaic more assyrian than the other aramaic languages that exists, for example mandaic? all that are eastern or central aramaic etc....

Why cant maronites be assyrians? is it because they dont identify themselves as it? they do speak western syriac after all....

What is it that makes us assyrians? it cant be the language because many different ethnic groups speak it. is it because we always identify ourselves as assyrians, our forefathers?
easy

 
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