• Our popular and beloved forums are finally back, after being down since April 2018 due to hosting and server issues. We have now switched to a better platform, while maintenaing all data as it was before (contents and user names) . Thank you for your patience and loyalty. If you have any questions, need to report an error, or are having trouble logging in, please email us at: assyrianvoice@rogers.com

Is Honor killing common among Assyrians?

Cascade

Active member
mrzurnaci said:
well that and American protestants. We act nothing like American protestants. Our religion is simultaneously our culture which is Middle Eastern...
I know, but the Assyrian church and Protestantism are both Christian sects who believe in the trinity. Also like the Protestants, the Assyrian church doesn't have icons of Jesus and Mary, and our worship is mostly aimed at Jesus. Catholic and Orthodox churches have artwork of the figures and they would idolize Mary like she's a goddess. Interesting thing, the difference, since we are also traditional like the orthodox and Catholics, but yet we don't revere Mary to that extent. So we are a lot like the Protestants than you'd imagine.

And from a purely objective view (since I don't adhere to either), I find myself more in good harmony in a Protestant church (Assyrian/Arabic ones) than in our gloomy, somber, pompous churches that have so many gossipers and doleful people surrounding you. And priests who think that we are obliged to kiss their palms.  :blink: :ban:
 

mrzurnaci

Active member
Neon said:
I know, but the Assyrian church and Protestantism are both Christian sects who believe in the trinity. Also like the Protestants, the Assyrian church doesn't have icons of Jesus and Mary, and our worship is mostly aimed at Jesus. Catholic and Orthodox churches have artwork of the figures and they would idolize Mary like she's a goddess. Interesting thing, the difference, since we are also traditional like the orthodox and Catholics, but yet we don't revere Mary to that extent. So we are a lot like the Protestants than you'd imagine.

And from a purely objective view (since I don't adhere to either), I find myself more in good harmony in a Protestant church (Assyrian/Arabic ones) than in our gloomy, somber, pompous churches that have so many gossipers and doleful people surrounding you. And priests who think that we are obliged to kiss their palms.  :blink: :ban:

Protestantism also believes that you don't need to do good deeds to go to heaven, faith alone in Jesus is enough...

How are you so sure our churches didn't originally have iconic works and artwork? How do you not know the Muslims didn't destroy it or force us to remove them?

Assyrians don't worship Mary because of our history concerning Nestorianism.

Our similarity with Protestantism is purely coincidental, not for similar reasons...

Gossiping and Pessimism seems to be a common Assyrian, Jewish, and Muslim traits lol...
 

Cascade

Active member
mrzurnaci said:
Protestantism also believes that you don't need to do good deeds to go to heaven, faith alone in Jesus is enough...
Yes, that. But then again, doesn't the bible say that? I've always thought that Protestantism comes closer to the biblical accounts.

How are you so sure our churches didn't originally have iconic works and artwork? How do you not know the Muslims didn't destroy it or force us to remove them?
I'm talking about modern Assyrian churches in the Western world. We can add whatever we want in them -- Nobody's holding us. And why would the Muslims hinder us from putting Jesus's iconography in our churches today? What's stopping us?

Correct me if I'm wrong, I think it's not in our sect to add icons and statues in our churches? And that's actually a good thing -- I thought the bible prohibited likeness of God and "idols".

Assyrians don't worship Mary because of our history concerning Nestorianism.
Again, this makes it more truer to the bible - "Worship only the Lord thy God"

Our similarity with Protestantism is purely coincidental, not for similar reasons...
Or maybe, you can say that Protestantism got it from us since we were one of the first churches. We could be their "parent species", as with Catholics and Orthodox. Picture it as a family tree.

Gossiping and Pessimism seems to be a common Assyrian, Jewish, and Muslim traits lol...
You can say that, but how come our Assyrian Anglican churches (with ASSYRIANS) are very cheerful and bright? Ever been there? I find myself more "accepted" and in good harmony in those churches than in ours. Maybe the traditional and somber tone of our churches dampens the people's mood? When I'm in an Assyrian church I would usually think of Gimli's quote (from LOTR), "you'll find more cheer in a graveyard".  :giggle:
 

mrzurnaci

Active member
Neon said:
Yes, that. But then again, doesn't the bible say that? I've always thought that Protestantism comes closer to the biblical accounts.
I'm talking about modern Assyrian churches in the Western world. We can add whatever we want in them -- Nobody's holding us. And why would the Muslims hinder us from putting Jesus's iconography in our churches today? What's stopping us?

Correct me if I'm wrong, I think it's not in our sect to add icons and statues in our churches? And that's actually a good thing -- I thought the bible prohibited likeness of God and "idols".
Again, this makes it more truer to the bible - "Worship only the Lord thy God"
Or maybe, you can say that Protestantism got it from us since we were one of the first churches. We could be their "parent species", as with Catholics and Orthodox. Picture it as a family tree.
You can say that, but how come our Assyrian Anglican churches (with ASSYRIANS) are very cheerful and bright? Ever been there? I find myself more "accepted" and in good harmony in those churches than in ours. Maybe the traditional and somber tone of our churches dampens the people's mood? When I'm in an Assyrian church I would usually think of Gimli's quote (from LOTR), "you'll find more cheer in a graveyard".  :giggle:

I don't freaking know, I'm not a theologist or Assyrian Church Historian.

The only time I ever look up history on our church is to use it as back up evidence to prove our existence back then...

The only thing I do in Church is read the Sureth textbooks they have.

As for the dark and somber tone you talk of, usually that occurs depending on the atmosphere of the church, especially if the church has like dark colors and the hymns are sung in a depressing way.

The church I went to last night for Christmas Qurbana was bright and colorful and the choir was singing upliftingly and happy in tone.
 

Cascade

Active member
mrzurnaci said:
I don't freaking know, I'm not a theologist or Assyrian Church Historian.

The only time I ever look up history on our church is to use it as back up evidence to prove our existence back then...

The only thing I do in Church is read the Sureth textbooks they have.

As for the dark and somber tone you talk of, usually that occurs depending on the atmosphere of the church, especially if the church has like dark colors and the hymns are sung in a depressing way.

The church I went to last night for Christmas Qurbana was bright and colorful and the choir was singing upliftingly and happy in tone.
Funny you mention the Christmas night, because that's the only time of the year when the church would have an uplifting tone.

The colours are normal. I'm guessing it's the hymns, which are usually in the harmonic minor key (ouch). The people also look daunted and distressed for some reason. I don't know.
 

mrzurnaci

Active member
Neon said:
Funny you mention the Christmas night, because that's the only time of the year when the church would have an uplifting tone.

The colours are normal. I'm guessing it's the hymns, which are usually in the harmonic minor key (ouch). The people also look daunted and distressed for some reason. I don't know.

it would help more if Church didn't feel like you were running an errand or feeling like you were doing a chore.

I say the Church needs to run more activities, especially activities that are fun for adults and teenagers to really feel like part of the church.

The Church is built by the community; if the community is falling apart, so does the church...

The only reason I'm not doing anything is because I'm damn lazy, I've been lazy my whole life to be honest. The only time I get up and do something is when it really does interest me.
 

Cascade

Active member
mrzurnaci said:
it would help more if Church didn't feel like you were running an errand or feeling like you were doing a chore.

I say the Church needs to run more activities, especially activities that are fun for adults and teenagers to really feel like part of the church.
Not sure if you know about this, but we do have an Assyrian Youth Group based on our church here in Sydney. They do fun activities such as picnics, walking, excursions/field trips, etc.

And that's outside of the church, really. How about activities that they can do INSIDE the church & during the mass? Like, changing the wonted routine - Addition of fun & exciting hymns and how about younger priests to attract the youth (the typical 70 year old priests can be so wearying).
 

mrzurnaci

Active member
Neon said:
Not sure if you know about this, but we do have an Assyrian Youth Group based on our church here in Sydney. They do fun activities such as picnics, walking, excursions/field trips, etc.

And that's outside of the church, really. How about activities that they can do INSIDE the church & during the mass? Like, changing the wonted routine - Addition of fun & exciting hymns and how about younger priests to attract the youth (the typical 70 year old priests can be so wearying).

My God, All I hear from Assyrians is how good Australia is. Stop making me Jealous lol.

Why can't we have all that in Chicago as well? thousands of Assyrians in one city and no Assyrian specific school!
 

Cascade

Active member
mrzurnaci said:
My God, All I hear from Assyrians is how good Australia is. Stop making me Jealous lol.

Why can't we have all that in Chicago as well? thousands of Assyrians in one city and no Assyrian specific school!
I think it's cos you guys have a lot of ethnic minorities and are rarely recognized. There isn't a place in Chicago that is mainly made up of Assyrians, right?

In Sydney, there's a suburb that's 75% Assyrian (Fairfield). So of course we can "power up" and build stuff in our name.
 

mrzurnaci

Active member
Neon said:
I think it's cos you guys have a lot of ethnic minorities and are rarely recognized. There isn't a place in Chicago that is mainly made up of Assyrians, right?

In Sydney, there's a suburb that's 75% Assyrian (Fairfield). So of course we can "power up" and build stuff in our name.

so why is it that Australian Assyrians can stand each other enough that they can group up into a single area but Chicago and California Assyrians barely do?

The only I know that has a larger concentration of Assyrians is Niles but it's only 3% Assyrian.
 

Cascade

Active member
mrzurnaci said:
so why is it that Australian Assyrians can stand each other enough that they can group up into a single area but Chicago and California Assyrians barely do?

The only I know that has a larger concentration of Assyrians is Niles but it's only 3% Assyrian.
Like I said it's because Chicago and California has tons of ethnicities, where Assyrians can't stand out and unite. The ethnic groups in American cities, I believe, tend to be dispersed.
 

mrzurnaci

Active member
Neon said:
Like I said it's because Chicago and California has tons of ethnicities, where Assyrians can't stand out and unite. The ethnic groups in American cities, I believe, tend to be dispersed.

then how is the Jewish community of Chicago uniting? If they can do it, Assyrians can do too.
 

Cascade

Active member
mrzurnaci said:
then how is the Jewish community of Chicago uniting? If they can do it, Assyrians can do too.
Let's face it, there are around 400K Jews in Chicago. And how many Assyrians are in Chicago? 10K, 15K? On a broader view, there are almost 8 million Jews in America and only 400K Assyrians. 

Assyrians simply can't hold a candle to the Jews.
 

mrzurnaci

Active member
Neon said:
Let's face it, there are around 400K Jews in Chicago. And how many Assyrians are in Chicago? 10K, 15K? On a broader view, there are almost 8 million Jews in America and only 400K Assyrians. 

Assyrians simply can't hold a candle to the Jews.

this source (DellaPergola, Sergio (2015). Dashefsky, Arnold; Sheskin, Ira, eds. "World Jewish Population, 2014". North American Jewish Data Bank. Retrieved November 8, 2015.) says that there's 6.8 million Jews in all of the USA, not (almost) 8m... Where do you get your numbers from?

so from your wording, you're saying that Jews are getting what they want because they have a larger number.

According to this source -> "The Association of Religion Data Archives | Maps & Reports". Thearda.com. Retrieved 2012-06-11.

There's 264,000 Jews in Chicago.

Unfortunately, I cannot obtain any credible number of Assyrians in chicago. My instinct believes that they fudged up the numbers for the 2010 US census...
 

Cascade

Active member
mrzurnaci said:
this source (DellaPergola, Sergio (2015). Dashefsky, Arnold; Sheskin, Ira, eds. "World Jewish Population, 2014". North American Jewish Data Bank. Retrieved November 8, 2015.) says that there's 6.8 million Jews in all of the USA, not (almost) 8m... Where do you get your numbers from?

so from your wording, you're saying that Jews are getting what they want because they have a larger number.

According to this source -> "The Association of Religion Data Archives | Maps & Reports". Thearda.com. Retrieved 2012-06-11.

There's 264,000 Jews in Chicago.

Unfortunately, I cannot obtain any credible number of Assyrians in chicago. My instinct believes that they fudged up the numbers for the 2010 US census...
It might not be the best source but Wikipedia says there are around 5 to 8 million Jews in the US (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Jews).

Yes, isn't that common sense anyway? The higher the population the higher the advantages?

There were 200K Jews in Chicago by the end of 20th century. I thought there would've been more by now (my 400K was a rough estimation). But still, 200K in one city is massive.
 

mrzurnaci

Active member
Neon said:
It might not be the best source but Wikipedia says there are around 5 to 8 million Jews in the US (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Jews).

Yes, isn't that common sense anyway? The higher the population the higher the advantages?

There were 200K Jews in Chicago by the end of 20th century. I thought there would've been more by now (my 400K was a rough estimation). But still, 200K in one city is massive.

Yes but there's 400k Assyrians in the USA total. Imagine our advantages if we were all in one place?
 

Cascade

Active member
mrzurnaci said:
Yes but there's 400k Assyrians in the USA total. Imagine our advantages if we were all in one place?
Yes, and that would've been much better.

I don't know why Assyrians are so dispersed in the US, whereas in AUS we are mostly concentrated in two cities (Sydney and Melbourne). You'll rarely find Assyrians in Brisbane, Perth and Adelaide. Domanic is from Brisbane and he has to be the only Assyrian that I know (or heard of) who lives there. Lol.

Oh and in those two cities, especially in Sydney, we have "enclaves" that are made up of a lot of Assyrians. In other words, even in our cities (such as Sydney, can't speak for Melbourne), Assyrians are stuck together.

In these Sydney suburbs, we are a majority, or at least to the point where we are mentioned in the census:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenfield_Park,_New_South_Wales#Population
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairfield,_New_South_Wales#Demographics
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bossley_Park
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edensor_Park,_New_South_Wales#Population
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bossley_Park#Places_of_worship
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cecil_Park,_New_South_Wales
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prairiewood,_New_South_Wales#Population
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abbotsbury,_New_South_Wales#Demographics

I doubt that US has that many suburbs that will list Assyrians in the census as the most populous people. We will probably be beaten by the other minorities there, like the Hispanics, Jews and blacks.
 

mrzurnaci

Active member
Neon said:
Yes, and that would've been much better.

I don't know why Assyrians are so dispersed in the US, whereas in AUS we are mostly concentrated in two cities (Sydney and Melbourne). You'll rarely find Assyrians in Brisbane, Perth and Adelaide. Domanic is from Brisbane and he has to be the only Assyrian that I know (or heard of) who lives there. Lol.

Oh and in those two cities, especially in Sydney, we have "enclaves" that are made up of a lot of Assyrians. In other words, even in our cities (such as Sydney, can't speak for Melbourne), Assyrians are stuck together.

In these Sydney suburbs, we are a majority, or at least to the point where we are mentioned in the census:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenfield_Park,_New_South_Wales#Population
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairfield,_New_South_Wales#Demographics
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bossley_Park
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edensor_Park,_New_South_Wales#Population
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bossley_Park#Places_of_worship
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cecil_Park,_New_South_Wales
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prairiewood,_New_South_Wales#Population
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abbotsbury,_New_South_Wales#Demographics

I doubt that US has that many suburbs that will list Assyrians in the census as the most populous people. We will probably be beaten by the other minorities there, like the Hispanics, Jews and blacks.

Illinois actually listed us as the most unusual ethnicity lol
 
Top